Okay, I'm replying to this before reading the rest of the digest, or
admittedly, even this whole message. However, I KNOW I have something
to say on this.
I wish to preface this reply. I'm a 20th level Enchanter, after a
marathon session last weekend(made 2 levels). I've done quite well with
jewelcraft, and as much as it hasn't made me rich, it HAS allowed me to
always have the money I need, and to continue with my trade. I'm never
wanting for funds, even when I have to lay out 20 or 30 platinum for
cat's eye agates for that damn Rune spell, which is GREAT when cast
repeatedly on your tank. Makes red creatures a cinch, usually.
I'm on the E'Ci server, and my name's Lotwilla. I've seen the trend in
jewel-craft devaluation, and taken some steps to remedy it. Every
Sunday at 3 PM PST, I gather as many enchanters as possible, and we have
meetings in Freeport to discuss our trade, pricing, and how to make a
profit at it. So far, I've reached in the neighborhood of 30
enchanters, and all have agreed to take steps to see that our trade does
not go sour. Freeport is easy to reach from just about anywhere, and
the tunnels make a GREAT meeting place for all enchanters, including our
dark-elf peers that can't walk brazenly into every place in the city.
I'll address things below. Also, sorry if this message is long, but I'm
a bit long-winded.
The prices that I encourage to those who attend the meetings are as
follows. 8 plat for all silver items that are less than jade, 10
platinum for jade rings, and on up from there. Usually at least double
the cost of the materials, if not more. Electrum, 15 platinum for items
up to jade, 20 platinum for jade and topaz, and on up. I haven't gotten
into pricing for gold, as there is already a set amount for it. On our
server, they seem to go for 30 per item, or 50 for a pair. Honestly,
I'd like to see the discount for a pair go away. There's no reason for
it. Anyone willing to shell out 50 platinum is just as willing to shell
out 60.
> I wish that price-lists and standardized pricing really worked, but no
> matter how hard we try, it doesn't have much chance of succeeding. Why?
>
> 1) Enchanter Jerks - For whatever reason, there are those who insist on
> ruining jewelcraft for the rest of us by charging little or nothing for
> their wares or by undercutting us at every turn. These false enchanters are
> just interested in earning a quick buck, not in jewelry as a long-term and
> useful skill.
Honestly, you often cannot deal with these people. I've found that a
little education goes a long way, but when someone is stubborn, you just
hope that one or a dozen people aren't enough to ruin it for everyone.
Where I run into problems is the higher-level enchanters selling simple
items too cheap. I sell my jaded electrum bracelets for 20 platinum.
The "heavy hitters" on our server sell them for 15. This makes it hard
for me to make as much of a profit. What I've tried to express is that
we're not selling the materials, but our skills. Unfortunately, I've
met with little success thus far, so I just keep plugging along. And a
bit of encouragement, I still have little problem selling for good
prices.
> 2) Market Flooding - Even on Prexus (a fairly new server) the silver market
> is already totally flooded. People don't know or don't care about the money
> you sink into the skill, they have seen on other servers or on the current
> servers that the prices are low to the ground and refuse to pay a reasonable
> amount for silver. If we try to save the market, it will have to be for
> electrum or higher.
Sadly, this will not change. Silver items are cheap, and easy to
craft. Therefore, all enchanters will just have to work through this.
Luckily, the target market of levels 8 to about 15 level is plentiful,
and so fairly easy to sell to. I find myself selling very few silver
items, however, and often refer people to lower level enchanters who I
know are trying to make a profit at the craft. I've even given
customers money so they could afford to buy items from younger
enchanters at reasonable prices. This does 2 things. It encourages the
younter enchanters to sell for good prices, and shows the people that I
give the money to that it is a very important issue. I've had nothing
but positive results from this method, and a few platinum here and there
really doesn't touch my bank account.
> 3) Non-Enchanter Items - It's even more frustrating to be undercut by a
> non-enchanter selling a similar loot item for no money. They paid nothing
> to get it and can undercut us any day of the week. Given the option of
> paying 7-8 plat for an enchanter-made intelligence ring or 5-6 plat for a
> similar loot item with an extra armor class bonus, who will choose the
> former? (example: +3 charisma necklace - a couple plat to make if no
> failures versus a doll that does the same thing - 7 gold to buy or free to
> loot).
The factor here is the slot that you use. I know of no ring items that
give plus 2 intelligence. The key here is to know your market, and know
what to sell to people. On this note, I don't use the auction channel,
except to get attention. I never quote prices over auction, and ALWAYS
sell TO people that I find, offering them items that will best suit
them. In addition, I'm not afraid to tell someone that they're better
off with something else if, in fact, they are.
> 4) We can't make what they want - True, some jewelry (int, str, mana, etc)
> sells decently. But, so many more want mana earrings or intelligence
> bracers or whatever that will never be an option for us. ("What earrings do
> you have?" "Only Stamina ones" "Oh, sorry, I need _____ ones"). Then, they
> go off in search of the loot item that will give them what they need.
At least half of the time, if someone is looking to buy something, you
can sell them something else that will be as useful to them. Consider
what you CAN make, and offer them the best you can. Once again, though,
you have to know when you should not waste your time, and when you have
to walk away from a potential sale.
> Does this mean we shouldn't try? Of course not, but don't expect a miracle
> because we set the price for jade mana rings at say 10 pp per ring
> throughout the servers. We need to educate people ... maybe a seminar or
> something where we all get together and sell our wares at the standard price
> and try to let the populace know why we sell them for that much and how the
> +2s and such all add up to help them out.
We can do this by educating ourselves. You're never going to educate
everyone on a server, but you can sure touch a good number of
enchanters, and if you get the ones you touch educating other people,
the effect will be exponential.
> I'm not interested in making a whole lot of money with jewelcraft (that's
> what my brewing skill is for), but I do want to make enough money to be able
> to raise my skill.
I sure am, and I do.
> For those of you who can easily sell items for what they are worth ...
> perhaps you can give a seminar to those of us who keep finding ourselves
> with unsellable product and dozens of tells from people who find out the
> price we charge and either say they don't have enough money or run away from
> us laughing to their nearest loot monster.
I am known to spend a half hour with a client, and that is how I think
of them, consulting with them on what they need. Often, this will lead
to sales of at least 30 platinum, on up to over 100. In addition, I
offer a ten percent commission to ANYONE who brings me business.
Finally, I make sure people will come back to me when they need
something new. You're never going to sell to everyone, but you can sure
make a tidy bit if you make the effort to establish a client base.
> We can save electrum if we start now. Don't be discouraged, we just need to
> teach people the worth of our products and come up with a valid reason for
> them to buy at our prices.
Any time someone asks me "Why do you charge so much?", I inform them of
two things. Many items we make are unique to our craft, and are hard to
find, and that I've spent well over 900 platinum on improving my skill
to the point where I can make what I do. Some people don't get it. I
let them walk away. More often, people shell out the cash, and come
back for more later.
> Thanks for listening
> Dietrich (Prexus server)
You didn't address one major issue: enchanters enchanting metal for
non-enchanters. I do NOT do this. I've done it twice in the past, and
it would take very certain circumstances for me to do it again. One
time was for a friend of mine, who paid me extremely well for 100 silver
bars. The other time, I enchanted one silver bar, and charged a
platinum for the spell. In my opinion, metals should not be enchanted
unless you are charging at least double the price of the metal bar you
are enchanting FOR THE SPELL ALONE. Nobody else can do it, and if this
strategy is adopted, it makes it difficult for other classes to be
competetive with us.
Well, I'm sure you've had enough, if you even bothered to read this
far. Thanks for your time!
Lotwilla Verditius, Enchantress of the Eldritch Collective