I don't think I agree that a monk with a snaring item is making
other classes less useful. Every other class as far as I know has
some means of stopping a runner. Monks are the lone exception.
Whether this is by design or the luck of the draw, or by design as
you imply, I can't say.

However, your message seems to be an echo of Verant's message
which I simply don't agree with. They say they don't want to infringe on
certain classes' abilities by offering the same spell/skill to another
class or in an item (eg clarity). They do this to encourage grouping so
that every class has something to offer a group. However, their design,
and in fact their statements state that 1 group slot should be reserved for
enchanters and 1 should be reserved for clerics and another slot should
be reserved for druids or rangers/wizards. That is, any group must have
an enchanter a cleric a snarer and an evacer to have a chance to do
anything. That leaves 10-11 classes to go for the other 2-3 slots. This is
not much of an encouragement to group since it gets very hard to find
groups at high levels. A monk with an item that procs a snare would not
stop anyone from requiring a class that can actually cast snare to be in a
group since relying on a procing item to keep runners from leaving is
risky at best.

Besides, Verant stated that clerics are the only class that is suposed to
be able to cast exp rezzes, but there is an item that casts it and can be
used by non-clerics. Regardless of who is correct, there is precedent 8).

From: imari_dellimore@...

DD proc's: This is pure damage. Damage is not unbalancing regardless of how it
is done (DOT or DD).
Alternative effects that come with that damage (such as root or snare
can be unbalancing). More often than not these secondary effects especially root
and snare can be down right annoying, er go the ebony blade - great ranger
weapon ruined by the proc.

The case of the rogue clinging darkness proc (is that the serrated bone dirk?) I
think this is something of a Powerfull advantage rogues have over other melee
classes. Perhaps verant allowed it to help the rogue out a little bit (seeing
as how most of their "skills" are useless). You would have to agree that that
clinging darkness line of spells is pretty darn powefull and make a duelweilding
rogue quite a little damage/utility machine.

I am still of the opinion that giving monks snare would hurt other classes and
give our class an unbalancing advantage.

As far as the name "treant fists" goes - maybe it can proc a druid DOT or DD
spell or perhaps a regen or damage shield?

____________________Reply Separator____________________
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [EQ-Monks] Monks role:
Author: "Sheldon Jolson" <Sheldon_Jolson@...>
Date: 01/20/2000 11:03 AM

From: "Sheldon Jolson" <Sheldon_Jolson@...>

Under this logic, why would a melee class such as a rogue
or a warrior get weapons that proc darkness or DoT or even
DD spells? We have treant fists. There must be a reason
they're called treant fists. There are no treants involved in
the quest!

From: imari_dellimore@...

Just to clarify:
" snaring glove or 1h blunt weapon would be an unlikely development."
What I meant was a "glove that proced snare" or a "1hb weapon that proced snare"
would be an unlikely development - regardless of whether they are plane dropped
or norrath found. That monk only one hand blunt weapons are coming is something
I believe I was one of the first to announce on this list and am "reasonably"
sure that they will be an eventuality (reasonably because until verant puts them
in the game you NEVER can tell what those guys will do)

Insummary : we agree that 1hblunt weapons are coming.
I strongly disagree that snaring weapons (gloves/blunt weapons) will
ever be useable by any class that does not already have a snare or slowing
spell: druid ranger shaman etc)

____________________Reply Separator____________________
Subject: Re: [EQ-Monks] Monks role:
Author: "Tim Perkins" <tperkins@...>
Date: 01/20/2000 9:44 AM

From: "Tim Perkins" <tperkins@...>

Imari,

The orignal person said just for fun what proc would you like to see and of
course thats what people want. 1hb weapons will be introduced into the game
of that I have no doubt as Gorden has already said we should practice our
1hb skills. I also think if and when a glove such as that became avaiable
just as with the 1hb weapons they will most likely come from the planes.

Kizmet Bayashi
Monk of the 48th..
E-Marr
Da`Kor

----- Original Message -----
From: <imari_dellimore@...>
To: RaceFace <bean@...>; <EQ-Monks@onelist.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2000 6:25 AM
Subject: [EQ-Monks] Monks role:

> From: imari_dellimore@...
>
> A snaring glove or 1h blunt weapon would be an unlikely development.
Monks role
> in a group is to do massive melee damge (reducing the load on the casters
mana
> at high levels). To give us snare would weaken the ranger/druid role from
the
> group some. Snare would be AWSOME, but it would mean we monks become to
> powerful. able to solo in dungeons and area we were never meant to solo.
>
> While on the subject of monk items:
> I have a question for all of you who did the treant fist quest.
> I have spent about 15hours (total in two marathon sessions) camping for
the
> humorous handheld mace off the alchemist in the Xorb gorge. I have
killed the
> two goblin guards there till I am blue in the face. Nothing has made that
> alchemist spawn. Is there a trick to doing so? Last night I spent about
10
> hours at it (and I picked up the camp from a guy who had been there for 4
hours
> before me and had to go to bed) So if you think about it in 14 hours of
> non-stop camping he never showed. Anyone who has done the quest can help
me out
> with some advice? I thought this guy was a 8-10 hour spawn?
>
>
> ____________________Reply Separator____________________
> Subject: Re: [EQ-Monks] Patch day is this wednesday!
> Author: "RaceFace" <bean@...>
> Date: 01/18/2000 8:04 PM
>
> From: "RaceFace" <bean@...>
>
> Snare would be great. Stun would be nice too.
>
> Perhaps ones that proc some sort of flame-based or force-based DoT.
"target
> is slammed by an intense force" or something like that. Think of it as
the
> monk focussing his ki into an attack.
>
> -Raean Bloodyhands, 24th monk, Tunare.
>
> > From: "Dizzy J." <dizzyj@...>
> > for fun, what would you want something to proc? personally, I really
wish
> > I had a good mid lvl set of gloves that proced snare. most usefull
spell
> > in the game imho. then I could solo in dungeons that most people dont
go
> > into..upper guk, runnyeye, sola..etc.
>